Pick'em Leagues: THE BIG SHOW CASUAL BEST OF THE REST Single Event PvP: FANTASY POOLS Betting Leagues: THE BIG SHOW BEST OF THE REST

Wagering Error

THIS TOPIC HAS BEEN LOCKED Print  
  Page 3 of 4     1     2     3     4  
Posted By Message

JLS

Heavyweight Champ

JLS Avatar
47
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:9,770
Career:4,410-2,328
Joined:Jun 2012
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
1,006
It wasn't 30 people PM'ing i did have a bunch of PMs but it was just 90% on how too much fake money was awarded.

No one was hooting and hollering about hey "I got paid WAY too Fake Fantasy Cash". But when it was reduced there was a handful saying that it wasn't fair because they used more than $1000.

The ones that weren't affected bet 1000.

This is my last post on this thread because I just don't care at this point. But you said you bet under 1000, more than 160 on your parlay, but you also bet on 9 other straight fights. Bets aren't placed automatically.

I believe that you did bet more than 160 on your parlay but I think you unintentionally bet more than 1000 and bet on more than 2 or 3 fighters like you're stating.

I vote for another Mod to be added. That's how I feel.

_______________________________________

Ad: Find out about FanDuel's newly launch game called Mixup

Post #31   3/13/18 11:21:21AM   

Braden

\\// & <3 mmapg

Braden Avatar
10
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:4,047
Career:1,682-1,011
Joined:Mar 2012
Camp: Dark Horse
Chips:
212

Posted by JLS

The ones that weren't affected bet 1000.



This is incorrect. Look at what I bet, an even $800, and I was still affected. Same with TCE. I never bet my whole bankroll on the first event. I caught it a couple hours before and readjusted my wagers so I could put them back at an even $800. TCE wasn't greatly decreased. I believe he meant to bet $850 or $900 and was decreased to $777, but he was affected and he bet less than $1000. So it actually did unfairly affected people who did not bet more than $1000. It didn't affect him enough for me to really complain but it did affect him and almost everyone else. For the people that spoke in my camp (whether it was public or private), there's 2 people that want bankrolls reset, there's 1 person that wants them left the way they are right now and there's a handful that don't really care, they just don't want the event cancelled altogether.


Posted by JLS

No one was hooting and hollering about hey "I got paid WAY too Fake Fantasy Cash".



Fake money, real money. Everybody likes money, even the ones who say they don't.


Posted by JLS

I vote for another Mod to be added. That's how I feel.



I agree. You do a great job but it's crazy that everything falls on your shoulders. I asked you this but I don't think you replied. If you stopped today, would this site come to an end? Are you keeping it afloat for us?

Post #32   3/13/18 1:34:56PM   

JLS

Heavyweight Champ

JLS Avatar
47
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:9,770
Career:4,410-2,328
Joined:Jun 2012
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
1,006
5 alive I'm done with this topic. Cancel the wagers, cancel the event, cancel everything. I don't even gaf anymore.

I'm sure the site would continue on. Card helps out with Big Show and does a great job and Budge does a great job with BOTR.

Last edited 3/13/18 1:48PM server time by JLS
Edit note/reason: n/a

_______________________________________

Post #33   3/13/18 1:45:22PM   

Braden

\\// & <3 mmapg

Braden Avatar
10
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:4,047
Career:1,682-1,011
Joined:Mar 2012
Camp: Dark Horse
Chips:
212
ok, lol... just don't cancel the event.

Post #34   3/13/18 1:47:20PM   

JLS

Heavyweight Champ

JLS Avatar
47
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:9,770
Career:4,410-2,328
Joined:Jun 2012
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
1,006

Posted by Five-Alive

ok, lol... just don't cancel the event.




I'm not authorized to do anything remotely close to that.

_______________________________________

Post #35   3/13/18 2:11:46PM   

jbmoviefan

In Full Mount

jbmoviefan Avatar
24
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:514
Career:2,510-1,530
Joined:Jun 2011
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
118
It's sad that this all comes down to a simple issue of resetting the bankroll, and that we've had this issue in varying degrees with both leagues on multiple occasions over the years. It sucks that JLS and other mods who receive nothing in compensation, other than a working site, might be taking the brunt of the criticism unjustly. Who should we be complaining to? Can you provide their information? Would it be beneficial to even contact them?

I understand that JLS does a fair amount of work on the BOTR side of the game, but other than updating cards and making sure the bankroll is reset between seasons is there anything else that needs to be done for THE BIG SHOW? I have this idea in my head that its as simple checking a reliable site that updates UFC cards regularly, adding or deleting bouts to this site accordingly, and that resetting the bankroll between seasons requires a programmer to log in briefly. Is it really that easy? Is this programmer being paid in some way to maintain the functions the mods can't? If so does this whole issue come down to mods not sending out reminder emails to the programmer in a timely fashion, or is it the programmer not responding to the mods request? The end date of the season is finite, so shouldn't you be able to tell the programmer weeks or even months out, "this is the date we need the wagers reset"? I think that other peoples frustrations, and mine in the past, comes down to the idea that this site is incredibly easy to maintain, and that the issues that we have are due to carelessness and procrastination.

I waited till the bankroll reset to put in my wagers, and anyone who's played this game for a length of time knows not to wager more than $1000 before the reset, though when the wagers weren't reset by the 48 hour mark the event should have been cancelled. What about players who had less than $1000 and didn't even have access to their full bankroll until a couple hours before the fight? I understand that efforts were made to scale the wagers accordingly and save the event, but in no way is this a fair start to the wagering portion of the game. I don't care either way as this issue didn't effect me at all, but if I were voting I'd say the only fair thing to do is reset the wagers to $1000.

Last edited 3/13/18 2:54PM server time by jbmoviefan
Edit note/reason: n/a
4 total post edits

Post #36   3/13/18 2:35:53PM   

JLS

Heavyweight Champ

JLS Avatar
47
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:9,770
Career:4,410-2,328
Joined:Jun 2012
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
1,006
@jbmoviefan

Its not rocket science to maintain. Time consuming it can be. Ufc Cards don't take long to setup. I don't think that's an issue. BOTR is much more time consuming but me and Budge got that under control. So overall the "game" itself is being ran fine. Not to throw anybody under the bus but 1 Mod hasn't even logged on in 7 months, another in over 2 months.



People are asking about accolades I've never done them before but looks like that area is being reglected as well.

I mentioned a couple times already that I'll be able to deliver the message that bankrolls need reset going forward.

People have given me ultimatums that if this is done or that is done or isn't done they'll quit and get other members to quit too. Those are "weak" minded people and they have double standards. They want the site to grow but threaten to help shrink it. I mean what is it? I don't need anyone to tell me they'll quit. Just do it. Or if they want to help the site grow invite some people to come play.

We had 515 gamers play UFC 222. Congratulations to everyone that did well. But if this was back in the day folks would find it a lot harder to do as well. Just in 2012 there were 2000+ Big Show players. The 515 players that played 1st event that's about right. Its actually 36 more gamers than what we had last season.

_______________________________________

Post #37   3/13/18 4:47:22PM   

george112

The Playground OG

george112 Avatar
10
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:6,140
Career:2,298-1,486
Joined:Jan 2007
Camp: Playground Bullies
Chips:
1,202
Well if it would help make me a mod lol

I log in everyday and don't have a job to distract me. Reliable internet, respected around here. Of course there will come a time when I have a job but by then hopefully things will be going as smoothly as they should be

Just a thought. Only trying to help

I see everyone's point and honestly even though I placed higher and waited until the bankroll reset I still think without a reset people are just going to be turned off.

You're great jls you've been doing a good job

_______________________________________
Jan 2007

Post #38   3/13/18 8:36:40PM   

LooseCannon

In Full Mount

LooseCannon Avatar
19
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:533
Career:3,063-1,797
Joined:Mar 2010
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
92
If the wagers can be reset without cancelling the entire event then my vote is still to just keep it as it is, but I didn’t earn anything so I really don’t care either way. I still think the winner Fish9888 at least still deserves his Top Earner badge for the event.

If everything must be cancelled & wiped from history (points, pick %) like the final event “re-do” about 5 seasns ago to reset the bankrolls then I vote absolutely 100% NO, keep it as it is, it’s pretty close to what it should be & was corrected as good as the programmer can possibly make it.

Post #39   3/13/18 11:51:02PM   

xdanish020

Fight Chemist

xdanish020 Avatar
20
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:2,921
Career:5,340-3,003
Joined:Sep 2008
Camp: Dark Horse
Chips:
337

Posted by JLS

It wasn't 30 people PM'ing i did have a bunch of PMs but it was just 90% on how too much fake money was awarded.

No one was hooting and hollering about hey "I got paid WAY too Fake Fantasy Cash". But when it was reduced there was a handful saying that it wasn't fair because they used more than $1000.

The ones that weren't affected bet 1000.

This is my last post on this thread because I just don't care at this point. But you said you bet under 1000, more than 160 on your parlay, but you also bet on 9 other straight fights. Bets aren't placed automatically.

I believe that you did bet more than 160 on your parlay but I think you unintentionally bet more than 1000 and bet on more than 2 or 3 fighters like you're stating.

I vote for another Mod to be added. That's how I feel.



Listen, I completely understand where you are at....I'm sure it was a bitch and a half to get the bets from being inflated down to what they are now, which is why I think there is some resistance to resetting the bankrolls to 1000, which is the only thing I find fair, as people still have wrong bank rolls regardless. I've either seen people asking for a reset of the bankrolls or people just not caring about it, I've yet to really see anyone come out and say they want to keep the bankrolls the way they are besides those who took the time out to re-do the wagers. I wouldn't wanna deal with it either but unfortunately the owners of this site suck.

Also it is a possibility I went over the 1000 dollars (I've asked to see my original bets 3-4 times now with nothing, so as much as people can assume I bet over the 1K mark, there really is no proof of that) but again, that is something that should be re-programmed after eevery season....I shouldn't have to check to see what event of the season we're on before I place my bets, not putting this on you but not everyone doulbe and triple checks their wagers to make sure everything is peachy.

I never gloated about winning 14-15K so I don't understand the comment about no one complaining when they had more money. As soon as you PM'd me and told me the wagers would be messed up and my parlay would pay out closer to 6.5K instead, I had no issue with it.......I don't know what happened with that.

Again, it sucks that it's on you but I guess someone has to do it. I've seen others vote to put the wagers back to 1000 for the next event (again, I think there is a resistance to do it because people attempted to "correct" the wagers, however it's not corrected)....llike I mentioned, only the second event of the season and everyone would start at an equal playing field instead of adjusting wagers and not allowing people to bet their entire bankroll like they normally do.

If the wagers can't be reset without cancelling the event, then so be it, but I'm not going to waste my time wagering if this is what is going to happen and as for your work it is appreciated but don't act like other people don't do the same. I brought over nearly half my camp from Valcom years ago.....I've created the majority of discussion threads which is nearly 2,000 if not more. I participate and get people to participate in BOTR, even though there are only maybe 80 people who play consistently.

I'm sure there are a ton of behind the scenes stuff we don't see that happens, but if you aren't happy as a mod, stop being one and have this site put someone in charge who can actually make the changes that are requested by members (as JB mentioned, this isn't the first time there's been a screw up).....again, it's not a shot at you personally but it sounds like you don't want to do it, so maybe some one else should. It also sounds as if you took my comments personal however you don't own the site so I'm not sure why you got so defensive about me not wanting to bet anymore if this is not corrected. These aren't shots are you, I think you are just taking them that way because no one else is willing to deal with it.

Last edited 3/14/18 4:14AM server time by xdanish020
Edit note/reason: n/a
5 total post edits

Post #40   3/14/18 3:43:03AM   

JLS

Heavyweight Champ

JLS Avatar
47
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:9,770
Career:4,410-2,328
Joined:Jun 2012
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
1,006

Posted by xdanish020


Posted by JLS

It wasn't 30 people PM'ing i did have a bunch of PMs but it was just 90% on how too much fake money was awarded.

No one was hooting and hollering about hey "I got paid WAY too Fake Fantasy Cash". But when it was reduced there was a handful saying that it wasn't fair because they used more than $1000.

The ones that weren't affected bet 1000.

This is my last post on this thread because I just don't care at this point. But you said you bet under 1000, more than 160 on your parlay, but you also bet on 9 other straight fights. Bets aren't placed automatically.

I believe that you did bet more than 160 on your parlay but I think you unintentionally bet more than 1000 and bet on more than 2 or 3 fighters like you're stating.

I vote for another Mod to be added. That's how I feel.



Listen, I completely understand where you are at....I'm sure it was a bitch and a half to get the bets from being inflated down to what they are now, which is why I think there is some resistance to resetting the bankrolls to 1000, which is the only thing I find fair, as people still have wrong bank rolls regardless. I've either seen people asking for a reset of the bankrolls or people just not caring about it, I've yet to really see anyone come out and say they want to keep the bankrolls the way they are besides those who took the time out to re-do the wagers. I wouldn't wanna deal with it either but unfortunately the owners of this site suck.

Also it is a possibility I went over the 1000 dollars (I've asked to see my original bets 3-4 times now with nothing, so as much as people can assume I bet over the 1K mark, there really is no proof of that) but again, that is something that should be re-programmed after eevery season....I shouldn't have to check to see what event of the season we're on before I place my bets, not putting this on you but not everyone doulbe and triple checks their wagers to make sure everything is peachy.

I never gloated about winning 14-15K so I don't understand the comment about no one complaining when they had more money. As soon as you PM'd me and told me the wagers would be messed up and my parlay would pay out closer to 6.5K instead, I had no issue with it.......I don't know what happened with that.

Again, it sucks that it's on you but I guess someone has to do it. I've seen others vote to put the wagers back to 1000 for the next event (again, I think there is a resistance to do it because people attempted to "correct" the wagers, however it's not corrected)....llike I mentioned, only the second event of the season and everyone would start at an equal playing field instead of adjusting wagers and not allowing people to bet their entire bankroll like they normally do.

If the wagers can't be reset without cancelling the event, then so be it, but I'm not going to waste my time wagering if this is what is going to happen and as for your work it is appreciated but don't act like other people don't do the same. I brought over nearly half my camp from Valcom years ago.....I've created the majority of discussion threads which is nearly 2,000 if not more. I participate and get people to participate in BOTR, even though there are only maybe 80 people who play consistently.

I'm sure there are a ton of behind the scenes stuff we don't see that happens, but if you aren't happy as a mod, stop being one and have this site put someone in charge who can actually make the changes that are requested by members (as JB mentioned, this isn't the first time there's been a screw up).....again, it's not a shot at you personally but it sounds like you don't want to do it, so maybe some one else should. It also sounds as if you took my comments personal however you don't own the site so I'm not sure why you got so defensive about me not wanting to bet anymore if this is not corrected. These aren't shots are you, I think you are just taking them that way because no one else is willing to deal with it.





I'm not taking your comments personal. And what i was saying is "NOBODY" was reaching out saying that they got paid "WAY" too much. I had to use you as an example since you're the one in this thread that's the most vocal about the wagers.

Your parlay as it is paid as of now is $160 to win $1,101. That's $6.88 per $1 spent. Your original winnings indicated somewhere over $10K which is completely impossible. If you bet the Max $500 that would still only pay you $3,440 and at $400 that would pay you $2,752.

I don't have an issue being Mod. My primary purpose to be Mod was to keep this Fantasy game as accurate as possible. Not make accolades, police the forums.

Nobody else as a member or Mod can make miraculous changes as you and jb suggested. Only capable of so much.

And "AGAIN" I will personally reach out earlier to get bankrolls reset.

As far as bankrolls being reset (mid-season) send admin or DTM those messages. Accolades are done by Grappler and Flashy who hasnt logged on in over 2 months.

And if you want to get your Team Valcon to blackball wagers and L2 then go right ahead.

And I'll just go back to doing the bare minimum of work on here originally what I signed up for.

_______________________________________

Ad: Find out about FanDuel's newly launch game called Mixup

Post #41   3/14/18 9:39:31AM   

xdanish020

Fight Chemist

xdanish020 Avatar
20
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:2,921
Career:5,340-3,003
Joined:Sep 2008
Camp: Dark Horse
Chips:
337

Posted by JLS


Posted by xdanish020


Posted by JLS

It wasn't 30 people PM'ing i did have a bunch of PMs but it was just 90% on how too much fake money was awarded.

No one was hooting and hollering about hey "I got paid WAY too Fake Fantasy Cash". But when it was reduced there was a handful saying that it wasn't fair because they used more than $1000.

The ones that weren't affected bet 1000.

This is my last post on this thread because I just don't care at this point. But you said you bet under 1000, more than 160 on your parlay, but you also bet on 9 other straight fights. Bets aren't placed automatically.

I believe that you did bet more than 160 on your parlay but I think you unintentionally bet more than 1000 and bet on more than 2 or 3 fighters like you're stating.

I vote for another Mod to be added. That's how I feel.



Listen, I completely understand where you are at....I'm sure it was a bitch and a half to get the bets from being inflated down to what they are now, which is why I think there is some resistance to resetting the bankrolls to 1000, which is the only thing I find fair, as people still have wrong bank rolls regardless. I've either seen people asking for a reset of the bankrolls or people just not caring about it, I've yet to really see anyone come out and say they want to keep the bankrolls the way they are besides those who took the time out to re-do the wagers. I wouldn't wanna deal with it either but unfortunately the owners of this site suck.

Also it is a possibility I went over the 1000 dollars (I've asked to see my original bets 3-4 times now with nothing, so as much as people can assume I bet over the 1K mark, there really is no proof of that) but again, that is something that should be re-programmed after eevery season....I shouldn't have to check to see what event of the season we're on before I place my bets, not putting this on you but not everyone doulbe and triple checks their wagers to make sure everything is peachy.

I never gloated about winning 14-15K so I don't understand the comment about no one complaining when they had more money. As soon as you PM'd me and told me the wagers would be messed up and my parlay would pay out closer to 6.5K instead, I had no issue with it.......I don't know what happened with that.

Again, it sucks that it's on you but I guess someone has to do it. I've seen others vote to put the wagers back to 1000 for the next event (again, I think there is a resistance to do it because people attempted to "correct" the wagers, however it's not corrected)....llike I mentioned, only the second event of the season and everyone would start at an equal playing field instead of adjusting wagers and not allowing people to bet their entire bankroll like they normally do.

If the wagers can't be reset without cancelling the event, then so be it, but I'm not going to waste my time wagering if this is what is going to happen and as for your work it is appreciated but don't act like other people don't do the same. I brought over nearly half my camp from Valcom years ago.....I've created the majority of discussion threads which is nearly 2,000 if not more. I participate and get people to participate in BOTR, even though there are only maybe 80 people who play consistently.

I'm sure there are a ton of behind the scenes stuff we don't see that happens, but if you aren't happy as a mod, stop being one and have this site put someone in charge who can actually make the changes that are requested by members (as JB mentioned, this isn't the first time there's been a screw up).....again, it's not a shot at you personally but it sounds like you don't want to do it, so maybe some one else should. It also sounds as if you took my comments personal however you don't own the site so I'm not sure why you got so defensive about me not wanting to bet anymore if this is not corrected. These aren't shots are you, I think you are just taking them that way because no one else is willing to deal with it.





I'm not taking your comments personal. And what i was saying is "NOBODY" was reaching out saying that they got paid "WAY" too much. I had to use you as an example since you're the one in this thread that's the most vocal about the wagers.

Your parlay as it is paid as of now is $160 to win $1,101. That's $6.88 per $1 spent. Your original winnings indicated somewhere over $10K which is completely impossible. If you bet the Max $500 that would still only pay you $3,440 and at $400 that would pay you $2,752.

I don't have an issue being Mod. My primary purpose to be Mod was to keep this Fantasy game as accurate as possible. Not make accolades, police the forums.

Nobody else as a member or Mod can make miraculous changes as you and jb suggested. Only capable of so much.

And "AGAIN" I will personally reach out earlier to get bankrolls reset.

As far as bankrolls being reset (mid-season) send admin or DTM those messages. Accolades are done by Grappler and Flashy who hasnt logged on in over 2 months.

And if you want to get your Team Valcon to blackball wagers and L2 then go right ahead.

And I'll just go back to doing the bare minimum of work on here originally what I signed up for.



It’s also strange that you would Pm me sayingmy parlay way worth around 6.5K and then in total i only made 1.5K this entire event. The 160 number is a random number generated by the programmers i did not bet that i would have bet at least 300 on that parlay so whatever math that works out to is what i should be paid and why the people if they did wager over 10000, there wagers weren’t just dropped to 1000 instead of 6 or 700 i also don’t u detstand unless there’s some form of equation that goes into every bet.

I did Pm DTM with no response. Just seems like no one on this site really wants to deal with anything when there is an issue. Again not on you but whoever has the power to donwhat they did got it all wrong and bankrolls should have just been reset instead of having them be wrong but now i know so i won’t waste my time on that side of the site.

Post #42   3/14/18 11:03:41AM   

jbmoviefan

In Full Mount

jbmoviefan Avatar
24
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:514
Career:2,510-1,530
Joined:Jun 2011
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
118
You do seem to be taking this a bit personally, and the only reason you get all the complaints is because you respond genuinely to them, so thank you for that. I don't recall making any miraculous suggestions, maybe in PM that it would be nice for mods to have the ability to reset bankroll, but I can understand why players of the game shouldn't have that ability, as you mentioned accidental or intentional tampering, though you never did address why this issue with bankroll reset keeps happening. Is it that the request doesn't go out in a timely fashion, or is it that the programmer doesn't respond in turn? I'm left to assume it's the former as you keep saying you'll get the reminder out sooner. To my other point, are you able to tell them months in advance that we need the season reset on a specific day? For example have you already sent and email to the programmer letting them know the bankroll needs to be reset again on July 10th?

Post #43   3/14/18 11:11:15AM   

jbmoviefan

In Full Mount

jbmoviefan Avatar
24
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:514
Career:2,510-1,530
Joined:Jun 2011
Camp: The Misfits
Chips:
118
@Danish - You original bets were roughly:

Parlay - $1700

Dolloway - $1000
AA - $1000
Yoder - $210
Viera - $760
Souk - $550
Stamann - $590
Milstead - $500
Ortega - $210
Pyle - $750

I checked the numbers and the way they scaled this was to assume that everyone who didn't bet exactly $1000 meant to bet that % of their bankroll. You had $10561 at the end of last season, and you accidentally wagered $7130 ($10561 x 67.5%). Your bets were scaled perfectly, as were everyone else's.

The real issue here is that there were 62 players with less than $1000 who couldn't bet until just a couple hours before start time, which is why realistically the only fair thing to do is reset the bankroll now.

@Danish - Just had to add that the bet on Pyle was really stupid, he had some of the worst odds change on the card, learn to play the game. Also where was your bet on Hernandez? He had the best odds on the card. You should give up on the wagering side of the game even if this issue does get resolved to your liking.

Last edited 3/14/18 12:21PM server time by jbmoviefan
Edit note/reason: n/a
5 total post edits

Post #44   3/14/18 11:44:39AM   

Stone

Belt Contender

Stone Avatar
15
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:867
Career:3,806-2,261
Joined:Jul 2007
Camp: Playground Bullies
Chips:
53
If you were dumb enough to bet with last seasons money, and not check back 48 hours out. Its your own fault. Everyone on the site knows to check back 48 hours out for changes.

Second, everyone complaining is a seasoned vet here. You all know how all of this works. If you tried to get ahead by betting before the totals were reset.. Too bad. No one is new here. If there were an influx of new guys joining the site, and hundreds were like, "wtf I didnt know about a reset?" then maybe. But we all know... Every person that was doing wagers before-hand, should have been messaging the mods and telling them to reset it. Then waiting for it to be done. It also only affected about 5 people in the top 27. Also, not one member of the Bullies had an error, or a change to their total... That should say whats up all by itself.

Its another situation just like that hotbout error the one time. The guys all went with the HB, and when they got it wrong, then they complained. It should have been done beforehand just like this.

You're doing a good job JLS, it is not possible to make everyone happy. And this is not your error. Do we need more admins? Probably. Are there many people on here able to handle that? No.

Business as usual.

This is all I have to say, I wont be responding after this.

One more thing**** We received 2 sets of badges for Season 32. I assume that would get fixed on its own. But we still have them.

Last edited 3/14/18 12:52PM server time by Stone
Edit note/reason: n/a

_______________________________________

Post #45   3/14/18 12:50:46PM   
 
  Page 3 of 4     1     2     3     4